Lisa Shea

Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet

Posted By: Tanaka

Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 06:50 AM

:( [size:14pt][b]Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet:[/b][/size] :( [color:#990000][size:8pt][b]Disclaimer: This is going to be a bit long, so you might want to grab a drink or make a run to the bathroom before you start reading![/b][/size][/color] ;) [size:11pt][b]Right now, Popo Chan is OK & in high energy mode (30 minutes ago, I placed a large cuttlebone in her cage & it has been decimated and lies shredded & crumbled on the bottom of her majesty’s cage. :grin: Toys are flung about with vigor, constant happy whistling and fweeping to my music & her friend Dango Chan. HOWEVER, she has been through a bit of a health ordeal & I fear still has a ways to go for a full recovery.[/b][/size] :o [size:11pt][b]Problem One:This is a continuing problem which hasn’t been resolved as of yet. :( Little by little, she has become a ‘hairy’ little creature. When I say “hairy,” I mean that many of her downy feathers have become overgrown (2 to 3 cm long – nearly an inch or so!). Included here are pictures of her fluffy butt :blush: (where the condition was first noticeable). But now, the condition has spread all over her body.[/b][/size] [img:left]http://i336.photobucket.com/albums/n337/Guregoreo/PC150136.jpg[/img] [img:center]http://i336.photobucket.com/albums/n337/Guregoreo/PC020122.jpg[/img] [img:right]http://i336.photobucket.com/albums/n337/Guregoreo/PB100011.jpg[/img] [size:11pt][b]Problem Two: Her left eyelid (actually “eyelid” is an understatement, it was really the whole upper left side of her head) became massively swollen, red & featherless. :sick: (SORRY, NO PHOTO OF THIS.)She would sadly sit on her perch & it was clear to see she needed help. This was very frightening & I honestly thought I might lose her. :eek: Help: Darn straight! ;) She was packed up & off we went to the vet. She was SO adorable as she weakly let me scoop her up & place her in her carrying case! Anyhow, as you may have noticed, I said “vet” not “avian-vet.” There are no avian vets at all in the part of Japan I live in. None. :( But I went to the vet recommended to me by the pet store where I met my two feathered friends. The vet was actually quite knowledgeable about birds. I was expecting to have to scoop up my girl and make a run for it as some incompetent “cat & dog” vet wanted to do some unthinkable Frankenstein test on my girl. But the vet was very gentle and caring. :) She was aware of many bird illnesses (many that I had read up on in regards to Popo Chan’s feathers) & treatments. Solution to Problem One: Currently unknown. :confused: The vet recommended using “Nekton-S” bird vitamins to see if her feather condition is due to a deficiency of some sort. What do you think of these vitamins? I have not yet started this treatment. The taxi driver who took me & Popo Chan to the vet keeps finches & he recommended another vet which treats his birds. I’m going to take Popo to this vet to see if they agree with Popo’s first vet’s diagnosis or not. We are not vets, I know, but what are your thoughts on Popo’s condition? IDEAS PLEASE!!!! :crazy: Solution to Problem Two: Eye drops. Twice daily for almost two weeks. Popo’s eye is now 100% healed. Yea! :D That the vet was able to get Popo medicine that helped has given me more confidence in this first vet. She also took the time to show me how to correctly hold Popo Chan, administer the drops & wipe away excess medicine. Popo & I have become VERY familiar with each other now! Every morning & night, I put Popo Chan in her carrying case, took her into another room and gave her the drops. Surprisingly, she didn’t bite or snap at me once. :whistle: In some way, I think she knew I was helping her. And even more surprising, is that she has not become fearful of me or my hands but in fact quite the opposite. My shy girl has become more comfortable with me. It was priceless a few days ago when Popo Chan's eye was totally recovered – She seemed to realize all of a sudden that she was better and manically began running all over her cage flinging toys here & there, chirping ecstatically and waddling all over the bottom of her cage. It was just so fun to see the sullen, fluffed up girl of the past few weeks blossom into a bird expressing sheer joy. :) She was definitely announcing, “The queen is back! Servant, fetch me a cuttlebone & keep those darn eye drops the hell away from me!” Aside from her royal hairiness, things are back to normal in our abode[/b][/size] :)
Posted By: illusive Fantasy

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 07:19 AM

hi Tanaka nice to meet you ...i understand kksuns and you go way back...anyway NEKTON-BIO is better for feathers and is specifically for the feathers and have you got a full spectrum light...you may want to get your hands on one of them as well...can you inform me what your giving as a diet to the bird please...

its very very late in the wee hours of the am here i was suppose to go to bed way earlier ...shhhhhhhh dont tell a few people lol...but as u see and they will soon enuf im still here but i swear only till im done posting this...as i must get some rest...

kksuns is super duper at links and hunting up things...like maybe a link for the nekkton bio or look under ebay...you will know its the one as the label has pretty feathers on it also...

good luck trying to find it there in japan...i deal with a few from china who have to export to there many different seeds and supplies and you may also need to do that ...

ill be back tomorrow afternoon here as right now gosh its 3:19am and im gonna be scolded i think by a couple folks giggle...but ive alligator hide...

ok i gotcha the link

http://www.arcatapet.com/category.cfm?catnum=510

may i also recommend some of this or PETAMINE breeding egg food

https://www.birdsupplynh.com/catalog/pro...2bcd42870e10e74
Posted By: illusive Fantasy

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 07:29 AM

ive added a couple of links for you...in ***above post...ive always recommended the nekton products in here as some will attest too.
Posted By: kksuns

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 12:46 PM

Oh my gosh Tanaka! I must admit I have never seen such a thing. I've seen the feather dusters but...feather growth like Popo Chan is displaying out of the blue? Oh my!
So sooo good to hear her little eye has gotten better and she's back to her spunky self at least..and also that the ordeal has brought the 2 of you closer. awwwww

I've done a lot of research on vitamins myself, and have to say the Nekton products are highly rated. Also just to let you know, illusive has years of experience in the avian field and she is usually spot on with her advice. She may not be a certified avian vet but she knows her stuff.

Shaddup illusive..I can toot if I want to! I call it as I see it and you have worked wonders here for MANY.
Maybe cause you're part owl yourself?? LOL
Geez another late night...errr early mornin?? tsk tsk


Very very best to you and Popo Chan Tanaka. It's great to hear from you...just wishes it were under better circumstances. frown
Pleeease keep us updated???

Get well soooon Popo Chan. You are just as beautiful as ever..hairy or not. wink
Posted By: Tanaka

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 12:46 PM

[size:11pt][b]Hello Illusive Fantasy! :) Thanks for your response. I definitely appreciate your input. I checked out your Nekton-Bio link & that looks like it could be promising and probably better than the recommended Nekton-S. ;) I found Amazon ships this overseas, so this will soon be ordered from them unless I can find somewhere here in Japan which can ship locally (Sadly, Amazon Japan does not carry this). :o I thought along the same lines as you regarding the full spectrum light. My babies get a little natural sunlight, but not much. And none at all during the cold winter. I ordered a light at the pet shop where I got my budgies. I wish I had one earlier, but hindsight (a.k.a. “stupidity”) is 20/20 :crazy:. When trying to figure out what to do with Popo Chan’s eye, I read about “light therapy” for sick birds in Barron’s “The Parakeet Handbook” & realized it could possibly be beneficial for her feathers as well. Hopefully, I’ll have a light for Popo Chan (and Dango Chan, too) anytime now. :) [color:#CC0000]Both Dango Chan & Popo Chan get a mix of different seeds/foods:[/color] Their main diet has consisted of Hari Approved “Living World Premium for Budgies” which consists of a mix of seeds, fruits, vegetables & pellets. They also receive a mix of two different seed mixes (Japanese brand – “Qualis”) Both are labeled as “Orange Flavonoid.” Their diet is supplemented with “Tropican Egg Granules”& Pittorin (a Japanese budgie food recommended to me by the pet shop where I got Popo Chan & Dango Chan) From time to time, they get small amounts of millet or oats as a treat. Cuttlebone & mineral blocks are always in their cages & getting munched on. Popo Chan (the girl), absolutely destroys them! :D Currently, since just before Popo went to the vet, I’ve also been mixing her seed with a little Exact Hand Feeding Baby Formula powder (dry, not wet). This is actually listed below the Abba Green 92A w/Seed Eggfood on the link you sent me! This is the same formula she & Dango Chan were hand fed as babies. In the past, it was mixed with water, heated & prepared along with the before mentioned Pittorin. I’ve tried all kinds of tricks to get them to eat fresh vegetables, but neither of them have gone for it. :crazy: They’ll peck at them briefly at times, but generally ignore them. They still get carrot, broccoli, peas & greens. . . But as of now, I cannot say that any of these are actually part of their diet. However, they do eat the dry fruits & vegetables included in their main food mix. . . Go figure! :crazy: When you awake from your “slumber of the dead,” I’m interested to hear any ideas you have.[/b][/size] :)
Posted By: Tanaka

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 01:13 PM

[size:11pt][b]Too funny kksuns, we posted at the same time! :D Thanks for your support. I’m glad to hear you’ve heard good things about Nekton supplements & Illusive Fantasy, too!!! :) ;) :grin: Popo’s eye was the vet’s & my main concern, but now that her eye is better (yea!) I want to get her hairy self back to “normal.” But now she is eating and drinking normally & her poop (it always comes down to the poop, huh? :/ ) is normal. She’s a bundle of energy, so based on this, I think whatever is the problem is not life threatening at the moment, but she will probably have to undergo some sort of an ongoing treatment/supplement. I just wish I clearly knew what was going on with her so I could do whatever is necessary. :crazy: I agree, hairy or not, she’s got a cute little fluffy bottom! :blush: [/b][/size]
Posted By: illusive Fantasy

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 02:34 PM

hello again tanaka...first of all let me send my condolences to your people and whats happening there...i wish for you and yours safety and a speedy recovery for Japan in this awful catastrophe...

i up just not awake...still needing a hour or so more sleep so i WILL get back to you again...by all means tho get the items i listed above for a starter...and hopefully a really good full spectrum light to place about two feet away from the cage...

also she is distroying her calcium for good reason as i noticed her toes do not lay flat but are somewhat crooked as she stands...try to find some liquid calcium to give to her also...

and no flavored cuttle bone or mineral blocks....ill finish this up later becuz besides no sleep i have computer issues...good luck hunting a way to get those things but im sure you will figure out a way to get them to you...your countries over there, especially china, dont have much for birds including good foods...

be back in awhile
Posted By: illusive Fantasy

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 04:22 PM

ok im back tanaka but ill bet your sleeping now...anyway i wonder if you would be willing to put up with a barrage of many questions from me and id also like to see a close up picture showing the entire cage as well as one from a distance showing the area around the cage too where you normally keep it...

i suspect this didnt exactly come on suddenly and was a ongoing issue...anyway if your willing ill private pm you so as to run by you the seemingly endless questions ill have for you...

also what size is your cage in american inches and is the other bird housed with this one also.

i could be wrong on this part but i suspect the eye injury ***may have started first then the feather issue either way the feather issue for sure was a while coming on and not sudden to this extent.

and yes kksuns if you noticed in the picture it looks like cage issues againnnn....but ill bet more than just the obvious as well but we will see with a couple of pictures. i also suspect some shreddy toys in the cage and those have to gooooo as well tanaka if you have any.
Posted By: kksuns

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 05:12 PM

Actually illusive to tell the truth I DIDN'T notice the cage when i looked at pics this morn. I wasn't quite awake yet. I did notice tho when I came back just now.
Possibly not powder coated? Is it powder coated cage wire Tanaka? So many, and yes mostly in Japan and China, are having issues due to unsafe cages. Heavy metal toxicity.
I didn't notice the toes until illusive mentioned them and I had to go back and look. You are SO observant illusive, Wow! Good eye!

I love the pic of them kissing between the cages Tanaka. awwww

I also want to send my best to you and yours in regards to what has been going on there in your country. I actually had thought of you when I heard the news, but hadn't seen you in so long here...I didn't think you would get a message from me anyway.So good to see you're back and ok smile
Posted By: Tanaka

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 06:48 PM

[size:11pt][b]Illusive Fantasy, Yes, I should be sleeping! :crazy: Normally, I would be, but a really bad movie kept me up this late. Thank you for your words of sympathy. Things have been very bad for many in Japan now. Here’s a shot of Dango Chan & Popo Chan’s cage setup. It’s an older picture, but the setup is still generally the same. My boy & girl each have their own cages, side by side. If you look, you can see Dango Chan & Popo Chan in their respective cages, so that should give you a good idea of their cage size. I keep their food and supplies under their cage & a wooden play gym & bath on top of their cage. The cage is against a wall in my “main” room (where I eat, sleep, work, watch TV, listen to music, whatever). The birds are definitely the center of attention. :) The back, top and left & right sides are covered with a thick sheet of plastic to protect against drafts. I used to cover the front of their cages at night because I used to stay up much later than them. But Dango Chan had night frights every once in a while. :o Now I leave the room light on low & the front of their cage uncovered during the night and his spells have pretty much ended & we all go to sleep at the same time. First click of the light “chain” and they all flutter to their bedtime perches. Second click and its nighty-night for all three of us. I’m getting off topic aren’t i? Thank goodness I have a three day holiday now. I can stay up and ramble in the darkness (first two clicks have already happened several hours ago!). Back on track. . . ;) [img]http://i336.photobucket.com/albums/n337/Guregoreo/Twnscage-1.jpg[/img] I’ll see if I can find any good close up pictures for you tomorrow. What is it that you’re looking for? Heavy metal toxicity? I’ve recently read about it, especially with regards to cages. Mine aren’t coated & I feared that might be a possibility, but when I bought mine, I was told they are made of stainless steel, how the hell can I tell? :confused: Is there a test I can do? I was concerned they might not be & as a precaution I asked the vet about this, but after her examination & based on Popo Chan’s generally active nature, good looking poop & healthy weight, the vet did not believe this was the case. Aside from the cuttlebone & mineral blocks, there are no other “shredding” toys. She has a lot of foot toys which she loves to toss about, a few wooden and plastic toys, perches of various thicknesses (both plastic, dowel and natural)& quite a few plastic ladders against the cage walls which she loves to climb on, but nothing that she rips apart. Her feather condition began a few months ago. Little by little she began growing these funky down feathers, but her vigor and energy remained. I brushed them off as being a silly freak of nature & I was expecting them to molt, and some did, but the others remained. It was a few weeks ago when her left “eyelid” seemed infected that her character clearly changed & I took her to the vet. The first day of her eye condition, her eyelid was a little red and slightly bald (probably from rubbing against her plastic ladders for “relief.”) & I thought maybe she got some cuttlebone “dust” in her eye. The morning of the second day, it was swollen & looked horrible. :sick: The eye itself seemed fine, but the area around it was swollen. I got her to the vet later that afternoon. I was concerned that the two problems might be related, but the vet felt they were not. However, she is not a trained avian vet & I am planning to get a second opinion. But that said, now that her eyelid has healed, Popo Chan is back to her active self. These past two weeks she has clearly been sick. :cry: Tomorrow I’ll take a closer look at her foot to see if it is crooked. I haven’t noticed it before, but you might be on to something. Thank you for your help & ideas.[/b][/size] :)
Posted By: illusive Fantasy

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/21/11 07:05 PM

ok i got pictures of then *** now i need a picture of your set up from a distance NOW...something newer as well and a close up please and its not one foot its the toes mostly...an yes kksuns i do have a sharp eye when im limited with internet on examining a situation to a sick bird...i cant do it in person and this is quite limiting...

tanaka will u go to private pm about all the questions i will be asking....???

Edited
what else is new...tanaka i forget to say things often an come back to edit you may in the future just want to double check on that issue with me

ok stainless steel should if high grade not show the signs of dullness and tarnish, that some of the area which is limited to what i can see does show...a good quality of stainless will always remain a polished look and so this from what i can see leaves a bit to be desired...and has more of the other metals in it that make up stainless steel. im on a different mindset track right now regarding a few things...so if we can go private it will be better

dang i wish lisa would fix these syntax errors that keep popping up in my face and shutting me down...its really annoying now.

Edited againnnn lol shup kk

tanaka get those dang perches made of wood and screwed onto the side of the cages OUT that dont go all the way across a cage...those are real good at causing injuries of all sorts especially during nite frights so please remove them as that may have been what initially caused this eye injury...thanks

i do however like what you did with the ladders to compensate for vertical bars...nice job
Posted By: Tanaka

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/22/11 06:14 AM

[size:11pt][b]Kksuns & Illusive Fantasy (and anyone else out there :) !), Sorry, I’m a really slow typist so I can’t respond now. :crazy: I’m soon heading to a different vet to get that second opinion, but please take a look at this site. It shows "my" cages & lists them as “[u]stainless steel[/u]” (it’s the cage on the left side pictured with a light blue bottom):[/b][/size] :) [url=http://en.item.rakuten.com/wellonshop/465i-s/]Dango Chan & Popo Chan's Cage[/url]
Posted By: illusive Fantasy

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/22/11 06:30 AM

omg you have got to be kidding me on that price....i want to know whats in the rice lol...thats outrageous a price.

good luck at the vet

im headed off for the nite...sorry we couldnt get it together

Posted By: Tanaka

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/22/11 12:29 PM

[size:11pt][b] Jackpot. Bingo. And yippity-doo-dah. . .or something like that! :grin: Popo Chan & I went to vet number two (the one I mentioned before who was recommended to me by the taxi driver who took me & Popo Chan to the first vet). This second vet works with, among other animals, exotic pets & has extensive knowledge & past experience with budgies (sigh of relief! :) ). Not only that, but he studied toxicology in animals for 20 years & at that time worked as a chemist developing drugs/remedies for animals prior to opening his veterinary practice 10 years ago. :whistle: I asked him about possible heavy metal poisoning, Popo Chan’s foot/toes & any other possible health concerns he might have about Popo Chan. He examined her food first & asked about her consumption of fresh fruits or vegetables. He was also interested in her general disposition & character. He examined her poop :blush: & said it looked healthy. He then gave Popo Chan a good examination & finally said vitamin deficiency is the most probable cause of Popo Chan’s strange feather condition. I told him that was the same diagnosis as the first vet (I didn’t tell him what the previous vet had said about the feather condition until AFTER he gave me his diagnosis, however, I did show him the medicine for Popo’s healed eyelid and explained her previous trouble). He recommended Popo Chan begin taking a vitamin supplement, and that’s when I broke out the Nekton-S / Nekton-BIO printout I brought along :cool: . He said that either would be a good starting point for Popo Chan & was even able to direct me to a pet store which carries them! Popo will have to wait until next weekend when I’ll have the chance to go and pick some up for her. With the vitamins & coming full spectrum light treatment, I hope Popo Chan will get back to her old non-hairy self! :) OH! And Popo Chan even got a laminated ID card with her details & photo. . . Looks like a driver’s license! Good thing I don’t have a car or I might find it missing one day![/b][/size] :D
Posted By: kksuns

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/22/11 02:29 PM

rofl Picturing Popo Chan at the wheel and Dango Chan working the gas! hahahaha Later mom, be back by 10!

WOW Tanaka, that is such great news!!! Sounds like the vet knew what he was talking about..and for them BOTH to come to the same conclusion....
Good thing you ended up in that particular taxi huh? Thanks taxi driver man! lol
Even better there's a pet store there where you can get the Nekton and not have to order online and wait. Even your waiting til the weekend will probably be faster than ordering online.
I would go with the Nekton Bio specifically formulated for healthy feathers. And if you think about it, if one has a vitamin deficiency the other probably does too.
There is a thread here somewhere titled "Good Foods". You should check it out..it mentions different things-seeds, grains, herbs and spices..dehydrated veggies.. you can get to add to their diet that are very good for them. Who knows..some of them you might already have right there in your own kitchen smile

I checked out your cage link. Looks good to me. I couldn't tell what the measurements are in inches tho? But stainless steel is fine. The price however O M G!!!!!!!

Gotta run for now. I'll check in later.
Don't be a stranger huh? Come back and keep us updated and just join in in general. You've been missed wink
Posted By: illusive Fantasy

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/22/11 04:24 PM

i agree on the nekton bio...and right now living where you are...id really not use the water or veggies for obvious reasons...for quite sometime get bottled spring water...as they are saying your milk/water/veggies are unsafe with radiation in them...and farmers are gonna need to destroy veggies and discard milk

and kk regarding your questions ...take it away ...its alllll yours now....have fun...bout time...ya git yer feet wet too....gotta go find something light for chow...cyaaaa lol
Posted By: illusive Fantasy

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/22/11 09:59 PM

these pictures of feather problems to valuable to get lost just yet so folks can see what happens with low light an A& D deficiences
Posted By: kksuns

Re: Popo Chan’s Double Whammy & Trip to the Vet - 03/23/11 03:00 AM

I agree, I don't think anyone really got a chance to even see this thread before it got buried. Keet owners should be aware of these things
Thanks Tanaka for sharing this!!
illusive brings up good points, again, regarding the use of the vegs and water after all that's been going on there Tanaka. Is it hard to get bottled water now? i imagine it is frown And I would just stay away from vegs all together for now.

Along with the Nekton Bio and full spectrum light for feathers you might also want to get something like Petamine breeding formula http://www.arcatapet.com/item.cfm?cat=774 or Abba eggfood mix(which I call the BOMB lol) https://www.birdsupplynh.com/catalog/pro...a5c758bf5fe4324
for added protein during molts and stress times. And since Popo Chan's feathers are obviously not healthy and I would think there is stress going on as well....it would be a good idea
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